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AggrorJorn

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    Leadwerks 5 Scripting

    in Programming

    Posted

    On 3/17/2018 at 4:21 PM, Rick said:

    It sounds like you guys are trying to merge them which might be a bad idea.

    Extending the intellisense of vs code so that Leadwerks specific objects are recognised would be preferable. However generating snippets based on the Le API is an alternative/backup solution. It is part of the experiment to see what works best.

    Leadwerks 5 Scripting

    in Programming

    Posted

    15 minutes ago, Josh said:

    You are definitely welcome to pursue the XML / snippet stuff. I don't plan on writing an extension for the debugger myself, I will just find someone who already knows how to do that and have them do it. I want to focus on the engine.

    Thats awesome to hear Josh. I am certain there are people who have made these debugger before. I am going to focus on getting the docs in to the extension now. 

    Source code can be found in github: https://github.com/Aggror/VisualStudioCodeLeadwerksExtension

    Package updated with some new snippets.

    5aad281bc05d5_leadwerksvscodeextension2.gif.301d1f3c5204e62ae543b2cf2a1ea265.gif

    Leadwerks 5 Scripting

    in Programming

    Posted

    So is this something I can help out with Josh? Snippets aren't a problem and generating them from the xml files is something that I can look in to. If you your focus on the debugger, I can help you out with the documentation stuff. 

    Leadwerks 5 Scripting

    in Programming

    Posted

    2 hours ago, Josh said:

    It would be totally possible to auto-generate the entire API by pulling the data from the XML files the docs are stored in:

    You could generate it and store it inside the extension and additionally let the extension look for the online version every time you start VS code. That way you have an offline version of the API at your disposal and when you go online, you get the latest documentation.

    Kickstarter tutorial project feedback

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    16 minutes ago, KilljoyHeathen said:

    but a template is something I personally wouldn't purchase.

    Making a template would only be the first step. It is the fastest and easiest step. Writing the tutorials and making screenshots along the way (and hoping you don't miss anything) is far more crucial.

    The ultimate way would be to do it like with Project Saturn: every other tutorial part would have all scripts in a different folder: http://aggror.com/downloads/projects/saturn/saturn_source_code.rar.

    In the end you would end up with the following project

    • Tower defense example
      • FINAL: For those who just want to look at the completed project
      • START: For those starting our the tutorial
      • PART1: For those who have completed tutorial part 1.
      • PART2: etc
      • PART3
      • PART4

    That way you can start from scratch, follow part 1 of a tutorial and if your code is somehow wrong, check the accompanied scripts that were made specifically for that part. Building the documentation this way is also the most time consuming process. But luckily with frequent and proper source code commits this can be done relatively easy. You could even make a branch for every tutorial part that is completed. 

    • Like 2

    Kickstarter tutorial project feedback

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    13 hours ago, Rick said:

    My mention of C# was simply "you" (creator of the toolkit) using it to create a UI to help configure things specific to a TD game.

    Ah I see what you mean now. Yes, that would certainly be a good option. Making a really basic tower defense toolkit is great but I would not spend any time on an external editor for an LE 4.x project right now. Knowing what we will be able to do with LE5 plugins, that just seems counterproductive.

    Kickstarter tutorial project feedback

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    My answer was about 4.x. For us it would be a walk in the park, but imagine a user with no prior developing experience. introducing 2 programming languages + leadwerks is just overkill. I think writing a program that is not build with Leadwerks/Lua is only a distraction.

    But again: I think you want to make it far too complex. This is just a basic game with a few tower, a few enemy types and some basic wave options.The complexity level is really doable with just a lua file or even an editor script.   

    Kickstarter tutorial project feedback

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    On 3/10/2018 at 2:11 PM, Rick said:

    Also, when I say 'editor' I don't really even mean visual map editor. There are a lot of editors for various parts of a game that help make the game easier to extend and customize that don't have anything to do with the visual map and I think can be done today in LE 4. 

    I think you are making it way to complex for a user. Sure, if you are going to go and make a full fledged game, you could make your own tool. But introducing a development environment outside of Leadwerks? Way too much information for a user to process.You are going to introduce a completely different programming environment (in this case something like C#/mono gui). People are going to get enough information as it is using the Leadwerks system and the accompanied IDE. 

    Kickstarter tutorial project feedback

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    16 hours ago, Rick said:

    Sort of like a game builder template add-on that still uses LE at it's core. This would of course require some kind of editor plugin for said editors and a more flexible map file format but it would probably grab more people's attention at the storefront. 

    Maybe you can look into that idea as it would become more of a solid product for you. Make a Tower Defense Builder system that has some editors to visually create towers, enemies, upgrades,  etc (I think you know C# right so should be easy to create such UIs) but still provide the main source that drives the TD game itself.

    Ah plugins: after all those years what I am most curious about is how Leadwerks will deal with plugins. Many users have requested this and it will finally happen. In the Leadwerks 5 forum section (backers only) there is a small discussion thread about it. Extending the editor would benefit the community a lot I think. 

    The tower defense builder system was done by someone else quite some time ago actually. I think an entire program is a little too big for this project. I just want to see first if there is enough interested for a small tower defense game. That doesn't mean you idea is bad btw. I know you have mentioned these 'builder' extensions before and they can be really great to use. But also massive to build and maintain. It will all depend on how extendable the le5 is going to be. 

    Using a custom 'editor' would be easily made though. But depends a little on what of type tower defense is made. For instance if you make a grid based map, then using a simple text editor is already enough for a basic map. 

    [0,0,0,0,0,0]
[0,0,0,1,0,0]
[0,0,1,1,0,0]
[0,2,0,0,1,0]
[0,0,0,0,0,0]

    Another way is using fixed points on the map where you can build. This allows more custom maps were a designer has to put more work in finetuning available build spots. Both options are cool implementations to make. 

     

    12 hours ago, Josh said:

    This is why I say using good artwork is so important.

    When this discussion gets enough input for me to go on, I will ask my friend to start making 3 towers and some environment props. They are going to be in the same lowpoly style throughout the game. This makes it easier to get a complete model set for a cheaper price. These models will be made either way. Just the amount would differ.

    Two Lua Questions

    in Programming

    Posted

    Interesting questions. I don't know if there is a variable in existence that gets you the callers 'self'. But maybe there is something hidden in the lua meta tables that can do this.

    As for getting the root there are probably neat little tricks you can do here, but not without the use of tables. Maybe this way: 

    --variable is a table
Script.myVar = { ["root"] = self, ["value"] = 10 }

Function Script:Test1()
	self:Test2(self.myVar)
end

Function Script:Test2(myVar)
	myVar.root
    myVar.value
end

    Or make a new class object called Variable were you store the above table in. There are probably prettier ways, but I never dug that deep in to lua meta tables.

    Kickstarter tutorial project feedback

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    • At the moment there is very little community activity in the forum. I think most people sit on the side line or are just waiting for LE5 to come out. I think that is why kickstarter 'might' be a solution in this scenario. If there is no interest I will simply move on with my own little projects. But it is also a repetitive circle: no tutorials because there is no activity vs no activity because there are no tutorials.
    • Tutorial about the game can always be additional. Having a complete game template would be a nice start.
    • "You might be better off planning up front the core elements/structures of the gameplay and then recording shorter videos as you do those parts."
      • I understand what you mean and you make a good point. There are also downsides on other approach. I experienced this first hand with Project Saturn when trying to record on the fly or sometimes with just a little experimenting ahead of the recording. Recording on the fly or with just a little bit of planning causes silly mistakes that are fixed only videos later while people complain in the comments that something is not working.
      • Sometimes you write code to show of that first part that you have working on, but at a later stage you removed those parts again, because it is clutter or simply because you have a newer, better system.  Both approaches have their ups and downs. I haven't tried the approach yet where the game has been completed before starting the documentation. That is why, after development I would have users give me feedback on the game.
    • ".......here's a pickup system, an inventory system"
      • I feel I would just be making an updated version of project Saturn. That is okay, but tutorials are scarce as they are. Something completely new can broaden the amount of templates.

    • Upvote 1

    Kickstarter tutorial project feedback

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    3 hours ago, Thirsty Panther said:

    I also enjoyed the OLED tutorials. I think these were less popular because there were no real world examples of how to use the knowledge. Compare that with Project Saturn which demonstrated how to shoot and damage the player, how to make a medkit and climb a ladder. Much more exciting than functions, logical operator and tables etc.

    I'm not a fan of Patreon. Paying money in the hope that someone produces something just doesn't sit well with me.

    As for the language I think you should stick with Lua as it is more likely to be used by beginners. Those that use C++ generally already have a good grasp of programming techniques. Perhaps you could run both if demand permits.

    • You are right, people want to see games, not the 'boring' syntax learning tutorials.
    • Patreon is a thing of the past now. It was very clear that that was not popular.
    • Lua surely will surely attract the larger crowd. I am just keeping LE5 game templates in mind with this project. If we can aid Josh in making public templates that people can import, how cool would that be. If you look at certain competitors, they have startup screens with the option to find other core templates to get started with. Even if it just to showcase the engine.

     

    1 hour ago, Josh said:

    My input is to make sure you have great artwork for this, both to present your idea and for the final product.

    That is of course more than welcome, but lets first get some more feedback. I will be sure to consult you before starting anything on kickstarter etc.

    Kickstarter tutorial project feedback

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    Hi Leadwerks community.

    Several people in the past few years suggested to start a modest kickstarter or make some sort of paid tutorial set available using educations sites like udemy.com. Previous attempts at tutorial projects didn't go so well, so a change is needed.

    • Project Saturn
      • Game from scratch
      • Users seem to like this approach better
      • In the end there were too many code changes/breaks in default scripts for me to continue this.
    • OLED
      • Lua basics and editor usage videos.
      • Tried out patreon: at max 3 subscribers. So I stopped using it.
      • Although the video quality and length were improved, the views were so low that I stopped spending time on it.

    Then there is also SplineTools. I see the same thing there, although it is not a tutorial but a paid script.

    • Very little usage
    • At the moment of writing, I haven't earned anything yet. 
    • I blame the Steam workshop partially for this.

     

    New attempt

    I really like to see more people using Leadwerks. So here is my idea for a new tutorial project. Feedback is more than welcome.

    • Kickstarted project
      • The endgoal for this project is to have a cool, complete tutorial project.
      • The endgoal is not to make a huge amount of money. however I have spend a lot of personal time in previous projects. I would hate it to see my precious time go to waste because users do not watch or read the content.
      • Target goal (price)? 
        • Honestly no idea.
        • Again, I do not expect to earn a lot on this. I would probably earn more money delivering mail or flipping burgers.
    • Game type: Tower defense
      • FPS is the most used genre for Leadwerks games so I want to do something else.
      • I require only few animations.
      • Several Leadwerks GUI skills to be learned.
        • Imagine clicking on a tower, display a UI object at that specific tower. 
      • Different tower types require different game mechanics that can be taught.
        • The amount of towers is not important, the game mechanic is:
          • Direct hit tower: good for demonstrating raycast. (similar to Saturn weapon tutorial)
            • Bullet: simplest effect that can be achieved.
            • Tesla: good way to demonstrate sprites/electricity
          • Area hit tower: either in a cone or in a radius of the tower. AABB example
          • Projectile tower: slow moving object, physics involved. 
    • Models/textures/Sound would be provided.
      • I have a friend who can model really well, delivers consistent quality and has a 'friend' price.
    • Progress of the project will be publicly visible in the new Leadwerks Projects forum
    • Project will be opensourced using Github.
    • Language?
      • Lua will attract more users, is quicker to set up and can be used in the editor.
        • This brings us also to the question if the editor should be used in the first place. The game could be procedural for instance.
      • A good showcase for C++ would be a nice change too.
    • Leadwerks version?
      • We have the stable Leadwerks 4.5/4.6.
      • Possibly new game template for Josh to use with Leadwerks 5.
        • Leadwerks 5 is a long way of though. Plus the game would be written in C++ since Lua is not available yet.

    Development process

    • Game is first made from scratch.
    • When that is done and passes review, the tutorials are made.
    • Written tutorials on how to make the entire game from scratch.
      • From starting a new project, to importing assets, to writing the code and finishing the game.
    • Depending on how much time everything takes, videos could be recorded as well.

      

    • Upvote 1
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