Christian Clavet

I am still planning to do some demo with Leadwerk Engine, but atm working on my main project (rpg editor), and doing some modeling work on a spaceship game.

What was the ability of the LW3.0 lightmapper in Global Illumination? Could you get a Illuminated texture and light with it? Was it handling well bounced light? If it were as good as in Source, then your shaders could help a lot! Just me to find way to get LE3.0 if this work. For static models (not CSG), this can be done by baking the light into the diffuse texture. Done that a couple of time with Irrlicht.

I plan to redo my "player" character for my IRB project (open source RPG project), I could make a version for LE and provide the final model with .FBX files once it's done. But I have lots of other things to care first, I've already took a note about this, and when I will have replaced my player I will make a version for LE. Animation will be basic. Should be sufficient for most. If you need for example, a swimming animation, since I will provide the FBX you could create it in any editor and add it to the animations. I've not checked the Asset we can have from LE, but surely some other have done something like this already.

@ScrotieFlapWack. I think your doing it the right way. I'm used to create very high poly objects (no poly restriction) then do a low poly version of it when the model is completed. From what I've learned most studios also work that way. I think the first priority for a model is the quality.

Too bad that all these format doesnt seem to support morphs. Could ease a lot of work when working with character expressions.

Micheal, the modeling work on these is excellent! I love the design!

Just saw a message from Josh on how to turn the FPS meter when using release. With the map here with my NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 780 got theses stats: To turn FPS display on release, just press F11. (Thanks Josh!) DEBUG: Min 20 FPS, Max: 200 Fps RELEASE: Min 50 FPS, Max 450 Fps. So release actually almost double the speed. When I was walking the map, the part where the frames are dropping the most is the top floor where the 3 "crawlers" are located. Just point the location of the crawler with the view and you will see the frame dropping, even if they are occluded by the door. Seen also that there are some flickering lights near the "crawler" place. I removed them and got some more FPS, but not that much.

I use the CTRL key while moving the crawler and it create me another instance of it. If I modify it, and use the CTRL key while moving it, it will copy it. I don't think this is "slow". I must have missed something in your explanations...

Thanks YouGrove. Done another test. I removed all lights (used only Ambient) The framerate still max at 200, and dropped from 200 to around 170 when the "crawler" was attacking. I killed it using the pistol, and then the framerate got back at 196 when it was in view. For the fun of it, I added about 8-10 crawlers and the framerate dropped to 40-50 frames/sec. For me this is directly related to NPC, could be a lot of things. On a sidenote, I was really surprised at how easy it was to add a functional weapon the the player. Will have to dig this lua code and see how it was done. Congrat. This editor is really simple to use! Checked on this technique. I did not know about. This is really incredible! Don't know if the dev will be able to implement something like this, but if they do, we'll all be in heaven!

I haven't checked how all of this could be done. But you would need to "rip" the skeleton from the crawlers and place it on your model then re-skin it so the bones will control the proper vertices of your model. But to "rip" the skeleton, you would have to load the model inside a editor. And since the model is already converted in Leadwerks and you don't have the source FBX, I don't think it would be possible. Then if you have done this, you would have to re-use the animations from the crawlers. Don`t know if that can be done directly from Leadwerk in code, or if you will be forced to do it in a 3D application.

Done, Thanks. The icon is there and fully functional now. I won't have to fix it at each update.

Hi, Sorry to revive that thread. I would kindly ask if the Leadwerks developpers would have to check on another optimization pass on the engine. Get very low framerate with the "crawlers" level (all of them, but this map is the most apparent, since it the biggest) I have a NVidia GTX 780 and Intel I7 running on Windows 7. And I get excellent performance from all the games I have here. I also understand that the product is being released, and there still more tweaks to do. Here is a screenshot I have taken when I start the level using DEBUG mode. Using RELEASE seem a bit faster but... On this screen, I got around 20+ with my current hardware with rendering only done in the windows (meaning that it's not even using my full screen resolution) With scenes with less than 4K poly to render, got around 200+ Fps (other maps), and these maps are really small. I've just got Leadwerks 3.1 standalone with LUA/C++ support for windows. EDIT: Done a quick map using the editor. This editor is really cool! Happy to work with it. temp.zip The prefabs are really a JOY to use!I've been placing the player and the crawler in a few clicks and used a menu item to create the navmesh and the Crawler was running after me! I've only been using the editor since 1-2 hours and I can already create a working map! Got almost 200+ FPS when I was building and testing this map, did not see go much higher or lower until I put the crawler in. I don't think it's the crawler geometry, as I've put more of them and the frame dropped but never as much as the first. Here are some things that perhaps could be checked to see how much they take MS per frame update. Perhaps there something to optimize in there. All reference frame numbers are taken from the DEBUG (slower). It was easier for me to have real numbers using this mode. 1 - Without the crawler on this map, regular refresh is about 200+fps 2 - When I added the crawler the FPS dropped from 200 to around 76+ fps How much the LUA scripts are taking from one frame to the next? Is the lua subsystem is refreshed per frame? Seen that the animated objects were creating a dynamic shadow. How much this shadow projection cost per frame? (seing a "shadow polygon" increase a lot when the crawler is near) How much MS the navigation system takes per frame?

Thanks all seem ok now. The only thing is that the shortcut on the desktop point to this when I updated: When the proper path should be:

Hi, Got some problems also when I got Leadwerks for windows today: 1. When I got all the files (Got the standalone version, and got it today). Tried to launch the editor, and got error that I did not have VS2013 installed (I had VS2008 that I'm using with Irrlicht). So got to MS and installed MS Visual Studio Express 2013 and then the editor launched. 2. The icon on the desktop point to a wrong path "program files\leadwerks\editor" The leadwerks executable is directly in the leadwerks path. There is no "editor" path. Quickly fixed this by changing the path. 3. Loading example map work, but when I first try to "run" it it gave me "map file version 22 not supported". Then I save the file and try again, this time the error is "map file version 24 is not supported". EDIT: Checked with the first Tutorial on C++ to load the default C++ project and build it. This work, and the map loading went fine this time. Then I loaded back the editor with this new project and edited the default map. Editor seem to work fine once I compile a project with MSVC. There is something wrong with the provided "MYGame" executable that do not like the map format. Seem also to fail with a new .LUA project. Perhaps the provided .exe for this is also in problem. EDIT2:I did some kind of hack by replacing the .exe with the ones I compiled. Was able to run the maps this time with only 1 error: "Asset map value is different". But I was seeing the truck. @Josh, perhaps you could check for the .exe that were used as reference. I'm not sure they are good with this distribution. If you want to check, compiled 2 new exe for the "myGame" exes. Just rename your old .exe in your project folder and use theses one. It worked for me. Here is the files:

Humm, this look like a overlapping polygon problem. Seem to me that the 2 faces are too near, if you could move it slightly it should render better.

I think Skyshop use a technique called spherical harmonics to light the models. Seen some guys that were able to successfully implement it on their Irrlicht project (GL2.0). The picture need to be "baked" into some form of highly complex mathematical equation, but once you have the equation it can be used in a shader. The light information it take come from the environment, so if you add dynamic lights, then the light information will need to be added to the result (surely some kind of blend pass in the deferred shader)

Even on april fool day, I don't find this an amusing joke. I hope this will never happen to leadwerk in reality.

Thanks for this post! I have a big interest for mobile (Android only), and would pay as much of the price of the PC version, but at the same time I understand your point developing mobile would need more staff and your current sales result does not show this as profitable. Would version 3.0 (Android) would still be available? I just want to use it to do some little demos with it and experiment with the Android platform. And using the same "workflow" would simplify the thing. Also the mesh format for 3.0 to 3.1 should not have changed that much.

Hi, For Lux, It would probably be possible, but looking at their log their mention more DX11 than GL. But if they have a GL version of their shaders it should be possible to port them. Then after it depend what features of GL is needed and if LE can allow users to use it. Edit: Quickly looking at Marmoset Skyshop is an image based lighting solution for Unity. They have a set of shaders using image based lighting with these: So all this stuff happen using their shaders. And their tools is for creating reflective cubemaps with pictures.

This is interesting, at some point we could perhaps have a way to add "plugins" to LE editor and add new tools to the editor to create geometry. (Editing animations and accessing bones would be nice, so we could do also some extra stuff there) "Probuilder" is a separate tool that is not part of the Unity editor and sold separately. Would be nice to have the same, as having a way for others to add theses types of things to the LE editor.

I think I will try to use Irrlicht GUI system with LE in C++. Been using it for a while so it will be easy to add GUI.(I think, and hope it will be) Is there any other OPEN Source solution that could be added as a GUI SYSTEM (I know there CEGUI that also exist)

Thanks YouGroove! Nice tutorial!

Hi, Josh! Ok, Thats is clear. Lightmapping had some quality to it that would be needed for realism. But, If you say it will never come back you have a solution to give equivalent quality of lightmaps. What you you propose for indirect lighting (bounced light)? To my knowledge, lightmapping was the only way to have those. The only "newer" technique that seem to do that in real time is " " but the hardware is not powerful enough to have a clean render. Is there already something in current renderer that does that? If we can simulate the "cornell" box scene with Leadwerks 3.1. Then I'll be really happy. If not, we have to find a solution to have indirect lighting...

Hi, You could search for GDD (Game design documents) as a references/example on the internet. You could use it as a reference to document and plan your project. Articy: Draft would be a nice choice tool.. Never had it, but it look really nice. To have more specific details in the GDD there are specific sections that are dedicated to the level and are named "LDD" Level design documents. Theses documents refer to the level story, items, puzzles (if it have some). I think I have some of them on my web site. Check on the documents section. Here, found this on a web site and give other examples. @mrstralberg: nice site! I did not know about this one! Cool!

Hi, Been reading this for days, and been questioning myself if I should write in that thread. From what I see, the changes from 3.0 to 3.1 affected a lot the framerate, But using performance tools, I am sure we could get speed back to 3.0 had, we just need some patience. I'm sure the developer are well aware of this. I find it nice that some users would like to help and create comparison between version. Could be a good idea to have a framerate meter on the demos and use them as a benchmark. Perhaps do some demo to improve the benchmark in lots of situations so the developers (engine) could have something to use with their tools to improve the rendering time. The things that I don't find that nice, is that some are pushing too hard. The LE developers know that the rendering is affected and is slow. They have more than a hint about it now. Then why compare it with much matured engines, and make it look even worse?! Theses engine, with time and popularity have much more budget and staff that is on LE right now. At the beginning they were worse that LE could have been. I pre-ordered my version, because I think the tool has the potential to get as great as other products. If you are on a real GAME project, and starting from scratch using 3.1 would not be advised at the moment. If you have a previous version that have the performance you need then stick to it until the "newer" one is finalized and reach the performance. 3.1 on Steam was released less than 2 month ago, what's the big rush about it?! I'm still using Irrlicht (only rendering) and its stuck in GL2.0 since the day I first used it (5 years now). They plan to get it to GL3.2 but it could take the whole year before they reach it.